HANSARD

Printed and Published by Nova Scotia Hansard Reporting Services

STANDING COMMITTEE ON HUMAN RESOURCES

Mr. Keith Colwell (Chairman)

Hon. David Morse

Mr. Alfred MacLeod

Mr. Chuck Porter

Mr. Charles Parker

Ms. Joan Massey

Mr. Clarrie MacKinnon

Ms. Diana Whalen

Mr. Leo Glavine

[ Mr. Alfred MacLeod was replaced by Hon. Chris D'Entremont. ]

In Attendance:

Mrs. Darlene Henry

Legislative Committee Clerk

HALIFAX, TUESDAY, JUNE 26, 2007

STANDING COMMITTEE ON HUMAN RESOURCES

10:00 A.M.

CHAIRMAN

Mr. Keith Colwell

MR. CHAIRMAN: I'd like to call the meeting to order. The first thing we're going to do is appointments of agencies, boards and commissions. Before we do that we'd like to go around the table and start with Mr. Porter, introductions.

[ The committee members introduced themselves. ]

Thank you very much and with that we can move right on with the appointment of the Department of Finance, Credit Union Deposit Insurance Corporation, Nova Scotia. Do you want to move these in a block or one at a time?

MR. CLARRIE MACKINNON: Mr. Chairman, I suggest that we move them as a block and if that is acceptable, I would move the appointment of Joseph B. Kennedy and Irene J. LeFort to the Credit Union Deposit Insurance Corporation, Nova Scotia.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Do I have a seconder?

MR. CHARLES PORTER: I second the motion.

MR. CHAIRMAN; Mr. Porter, thank you. It has been moved and seconded. Is there any discussion?

Hearing no discussion, would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

1

The motion is carried.

MR. PORTER: Mr. Chairman, I so move the Status of Women, Advisory Council on the Status of Women, Shelly Goodwin, Anne Kelly, Holly Meuse, Sonja Power and Rita Warner as the members of the Advisory Council on the Status of Women.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr. Porter. Do I have a seconder?

MS. JOAN MASSEY: I second the motion.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. It has been moved and seconded. Is there any discussion?

Hearing no discussion, would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The next one is the Department of Tourism, Culture and Heritage, Peggy's Cove Commission. Do I have a mover?

HON. CHRISTOPHER D'ENTREMONT: I so move for the Peggy's Cove Commission, Murray Garrison and John Parker.

MR. MACKINNON: I second the motion.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. It has been moved and seconded. Is there any discussion?

Hearing no discussion, would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

That completes our business with appointments. Now there are a couple of other things we have here. We received an e-mail from Dr. Henry Bishop - the curator of the Black Cultural Centre for Nova Scotia - indicating there was a very serious illness in his family and he was unable to attend this morning's meeting, so I would suggest that that be rescheduled for our first meeting in September, with the concurrence of the committee.

Is it agreed.

It is agreed.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Then the second one, I wrote a letter which I forwarded to all the members of the committee, requesting that - we've been talking about special education tuition funding and I have a couple of people in my area who have gone through this process and are going through it and possibly there are other members who would have people as well who have gone through this process.

I would like to hear their stories and have the committee hear their stories because I think that we've heard it from the Department of Education and I think the stories are very similar but it's nice to hear from someone who has gone through the system. I propose that we put that on the agenda for the following meeting of the committee, after the Black Cultural Centre.

Any objections or any thoughts on that or comments?

MR. PORTER: You're looking at the October meeting there?

MR. CHAIRMAN: Yes.

MR. PORTER: That's certainly fine with us.

MR. CHAIRMAN: I would ask our clerk to send a notice out to all the members of the committee to ask them if there's anyone else in their areas who would like to come and talk about how that process has, in some cases, been very aggravating for people and in other cases very rewarding. So I think it's a story that needs to be told.

MR. CHARLES PARKER: Mr. Chairman, you have a couple of individuals or families that want to come and present?

MR. CHAIRMAN: Yes.

MR. PARKER: If there were others that we knew of who wanted to present, is it possible that they could be here as well?

MR. CHAIRMAN: That's what I just said.

MR. PARKER: I mean to be a presenter or just to be a listener?

MR. CHAIRMAN: No, presenters. The idea is that the presentation I don't think should take that long from each of these individuals that I know that are different stages of this and it would be very interesting to hear of anyone else, of any of our caucuses, that have gone through this process, to see what the situation is and maybe make suggestions to the Department of Education to help people with that.

Mr. Porter.

MR. PORTER: Just maybe as an example, Mr. Chairman, two per caucus?

MR. CHAIRMAN: That would be fine.

MR. PORTER: Maybe 10 minutes if they each wanted to give a presentation. That would be an hour and then some time for us for questions, perhaps? Would that work out?

MR. CHAIRMAN: That would be great. Everyone agree with that? Mr. MacKinnon.

MR. MACKINNON: Mr. Chairman, two cases in my constituency come to mind and I would like it to be open, if possible, even if it was only five minutes per person that was allocated. I certainly wouldn't want to put one over the other in relation to that situation.

MR. CHAIRMAN: So maybe a five minute limit.

MR. PORTER: I guess I'm just thinking about the room and the number of people and the time. The stories, I guess, would likely be similar. Maybe we would be able to find one that had a positive side and maybe one if there were some negative - as well, we probably should have somebody from the Department of Education as well, to hear the . . .

MR. CHAIRMAN: To listen to the presentations.

MR. PORTER: To listen, yes.

MR. CHAIRMAN: I think that would be very, very good. So what is your wish? I'm afraid if we go to five minute presentations, people aren't really going to be able to say what they want to say. I don't want to limit the number of people to come but if we don't - unless you want to make a longer meeting because this is a very important topic, as everyone around the table knows. So maybe if you want to make the meeting a bit longer so we can invite more people to make presentations. It is totally up to the committee.

MR. MACKINNON: I'm okay with a longer meeting but I think the stories can be told in a short time frame.

MR. CHAIRMAN: I'm looking for suggestions.

MR. MACKINNON: The situation, too, is that we are usually dealing with people who have had problems. Certainly to round up people who haven't had problems is probably a good thing, in some respects, but I think it is the problems that we want to address. So to look for somebody who has actually had a good experience isn't part of the picture, as far as I am concerned.

MR. PORTER: Well, I guess I looked at it as obviously they have had some success and that could be a learning tool for us as well, what makes their story different. The other is, if it isn't different, how come they were successful and maybe there were some key factors in there to tell us why. That's why I was thinking if there were, and I think there are stories out there that people do go through the system. We should know, especially if we're just inviting the Department of Education in to listen and not to speak. It would be nice to hear anyway from the constituent versus maybe the department on how the success has been had. That was my thought on it.

As far as a longer meeting, we could maybe go a little bit longer. I know it is a busy time that we're back to the regular meeting schedule into the Fall so it will be a little bit hectic but we could go a little bit longer than that, I think, too.

MR. MACKINNON: It will make up for the short meeting we're having today.

MR. CHAIRMAN: So I would suggest that maybe we can settle one thing - would an extra half hour in the meeting be appropriate? Would everybody agree to that? (Interruptions) So we've got that part settled. So then maybe we can have - we could then fit three people from each caucus in, perhaps? Or is that too much? I mean that is nine people making presentations, it is getting pretty cumbersome.

MR. PORTER: It seems like a lot to me.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Again, it's up to the committee here, whatever you want to do.

MR. MACKINNON: I think we've had some large groups in to various committees over a period of time. I think of the Resources Committee having a lot of people in recently, in relationship to the brown spruce longhorn beetle and certainly there were people around the room. Some people I don't think will take very much time, they'll tell their story in a very concise manner.

MR. CHAIRMAN: So you agree to nine people then?

MR. PORTER: Yes, we'll certainly agree to that, although I think that when people start talking, and I know just from people being in my office, 10 minutes does not do justice to what even - and we're looking at 10 minutes. You cut somebody down to 5 or 7 minutes, they're barely going to have a chance to get started and when we're thinking about asking people questions as we're taking notes along the way specifically. I don't care, we'll take three, that's fine. I just don't think that we're actually doing the meeting or the purpose of the meeting justice, that's all.

MR. CHAIRMAN: It would be better if we did two, 15 minutes a piece? I can tell you that one of the people I have coming in had both success and failure with the system. So

they're very pleased with the system but they're very disappointed with the system. So it's an interesting story and one with excellent outcomes, actually.

MR. MACKINNON: Mr. Chairman, I think the member for Hants West is making sense, not that I wasn't.(Laughter) I would agree to the approach that he has and I will deal with the situation in my area with the two or three that are very concerned, by having them select one person to speak, if that's all right with the committee.

MR PARKER: So you're suggesting two people - two presenters from each caucus? Or not?

MR. MACKINNON: Well, certainly it seems that I'm the odd person out here today, to some degree, so I'll be flexible.

MS. JOAN MASSEY: Two people from each caucus, 15 minutes each.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Is that agreed?

MR. MACKINNON: We'll draw lots.

MR. CHAIRMAN: We'll have way more than two people from our caucus but we can settle it to two.

MS. MASSEY: You'll have to watch your wristwatch and keep them on track . . .

MR. PARKER: That's still 90 minutes.

MR. CHAIRMAN: Still 90 minutes. But I think the stories that have to be told.

MR. PARKER; Yes, I know, it takes time.

MR. MACKINNON: If we didn't have the luck of the draw in relation to the two, I'm sure the member for Pictou West and I could have one spokesperson from Pictou County, and the others could come in and listen, if they so desired.

MR. CHAIRMAN: It would be nice to hear from different areas how the school boards are handling this because part of the problem is within the school system, not with the Department of Education, from what I can see. So it would be nice to have from different school boards and different perspectives.

So we've agreed on two presenters from each caucus, 15 minutes apiece and an extra half hour in a meeting. Does everybody agree with all that?

MR. MACKINNON: Mr. Chairman, when you're in a minority situation, you should be very flexible.

MR. CHAIRMAN: That's been the case today. Okay, well, I thank everybody for their sense of fair play today, thank you very much.

Is there any other business for the committee?

[10:15 a.m.]

MR. PARKER: Mr. Chairman, I guess we're agreeing that we're not meeting during the July and August period?

MR. CHAIRMAN: Except for appointments. If there are appointments that have to be made by government, and that would be up to the government to decide, if there are appointments they have to make during that period of time, then the committee will meet just for appointments and nothing else. So hopefully, the government won't have too many they have to do. Mr. Porter.

MR. PORTER: Just on that, if there were - I'm just thinking where people do travel from away, for the fact that we're going to do maybe 10 minutes or 15 minutes, was it possible to do a conference call? But I don't know how that would work for Hansard.

MR. CHAIRMAN: We'd have to check and make sure we could do that.

MR. PORTER; It just may save - I'm not too far away but I know some of the other gentlemen here are a considerable distance away, a couple of hours or more - our member as well from Cape Breton. It is something to consider anyway.

MR. CHAIRMAN: What we'll do is check with a solicitor to make sure we can do that, officially, if that can be done and the committee agrees with that, we can do it that way, if the committee has no objections - just for appointments, just for these two months.

So we'll do that and maybe we can send a letter off to a solicitor asking that specific question, exactly how it is done, how it is to be done with Hansard, and we'll send a reply to all the members.

Okay, any objection to that? No? That's agreed.

Okay, anything else? A motion to adjourn would be in order.

MR. PORTER: So moved.

MR. CHAIRMAN: We stand adjourned, thank you.

[ The committee adjourned at 10:17 a.m.]