HALIFAX, TUESDAY, JULY 27, 2004
STANDING COMMITTEE ON HUMAN RESOURCES
1:00 P.M.
CHAIRMAN
Mr. Ronald Chisholm
MR. CHAIRMAN: We do have a quorum, so we will call the meeting of the Human Resources Standing Committee to order. The first thing on the agenda, we have appointments to agencies, boards and commissions. We do have a few.
MR. CECIL O'DONNELL: Mr. Chairman, to the Nova Scotia Fisheries and Aquaculture Loan Board, I so move Moody R. McKay and Michael A. Parker as members.
MR. CHAIRMAN: Are you ready for the question? Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.
The motion is carried.
MR. O'DONNELL: Mr. Chairman, to the Board of Directors of the Atlantic Provinces Special Education Authority, I so move J. Urban Cannon and Heather J. Macpherson as members.
MR. CHAIRMAN: Are you ready for the question? Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.
The motion is carried.
That concludes the appointments, so we will move on to our second item on the agenda. Again, we have Communications Nova Scotia people with us today, Mr. David Bell, as well as Ms. Diane LeBlanc, Communications Advisor, and we do have Miriam Murray, too. One thing we didn't do when we started was go around the table and introduce ourselves to our guests, as well as for the record.
1
[The committee members introduced themselves.]
MR. CHAIRMAN: The bulk advertisement distribution is the issue that we've been dealing with for a while as a committee. We've had Communications Nova Scotia in before, so they're here again with some more updates for us, and maybe some better plans as to how we can do our advertising. If you would like to take over, it's all yours.
MS. DIANE LEBLANC: Thank you for that opportunity. Basically, from what I understand, the committee is concerned and wanted to get an outline of some different options for a broader communications plan, in addition to the advertising, that will help address some of these concerns, to ensure the broadest possible audience is aware of vacancies on the Nova Scotia agencies, boards and commissions, and to maximize the number of applications from qualified Nova Scotians.
What we're going to outline for you today is a series of options that you may want to consider recommending to government to meet these goals. I'm going to let David start. I know David has already given you a little bit of a presentation on ads and that he was talking to you about the bulk ads last week and teaser ads. We're going to outline some minor changes to that, to give you an idea of what options are available there. Then, in addition, I will talk about some things we can do to supplement those ads.
MR. DAVID BELL: In keeping with the identified communications objectives, as Diane has already stated, to ensure the broadest possible audience throughout Nova Scotia as well as to maximize the number of applications from qualified Nova Scotians, what we're suggesting would be an effective media ad strategy - and I should underscore that the media buy component is but one small part of the overall communications plan, but, certainly, it can be a very visible one. As the advertising is purchased, it's important to ensure that we're getting good value for the dollars.
Just a little bit of a recap from the last time, I was proposing that we run a teaser ad two weeks prior to a complete listing of all the vacancies. The wording is changed somewhat, down in the bottom but, in essence, it's the same. The message is the same, with a Web drive to a dedicated Web site, as well as encouraging people to look out for the group listing in their local daily newspaper. We're suggesting two weeks hence; that, of course, can be adjusted to accommodate vacations and so on. Again, all daily and community papers, the thought being to maximize the reach and exposure throughout Nova Scotia, and that cost, approximately $5,500. This would also include such publications as Touch Base and other community-oriented papers, some of which focus quite particularly on smaller segments of the Nova Scotia population.
In conjunction with the teaser ads, there would be two weeks of EastLink cable ads. EastLink is the prevalent cable supplier throughout Nova Scotia, reaching in excess of 500,000 Nova Scotians. The cable ads, at a cost of about $1,100 per week, you get one
exposure per hour, 24 hours a day times 7 days, 168 exposures for that $1,100 on the EastLink network. The scripts and the static screens will be developed by CNS.
Now where we've departed somewhat, we thought that in our discussions and by our communications objectives that perhaps a revamping of the gross listing of those agencies, boards and commissions for which there are vacancies, we should, perhaps, provide an element of explanation to make an appeal to the general populace of Nova Scotia, appealing to their sense of community: "Nova Scotia Needs You" sums it up. The feeling that we got at the last meeting and in subsequent conversations with Darlene is that some people perhaps shy away from the whole process because they feel that they're not qualified, don't meet the minimum requirements, for a variety of reasons. So we're trying to make this a little bit more user-friendly, trying to involve more Nova Scotians, enhance the participation in the process, as it were, and in the process inviting people to self-identify.
Also a departure from what we've done previously is to have a grouping of the agencies, boards and commissions by departmental responsibilities. You have samples of both here. The intention was not to provide that grouping, but merely a format so you could see how this would appear in the paper. This is reduced somewhat. This would be full-depth and two-thirds width in the ChronicleHerald, so in essence it would be 60 per cent of a full page. This being a departure from the formal notification ad, the format which we have used for the last few years. We also have settled on The Herald, the Cape Breton Post and The Daily News.
Once again, to enhance the exposure, to maximize the reach to as many Nova Scotians as possible, we're suggesting that it appear once in all six dailies. There are six daily papers, varying circulations. The Herald, obviously, is the largest by far, but Amherst, New Glasgow, Truro each have their own daily paper, which is read quite faithfully, and we feel it's important. Everyone within Nova Scotia has access to a daily newspaper. With the teaser ad promoting people to look out for the ad in an upcoming edition of the daily paper, we're hoping that we can generate some interest. Diane will also expound on how we can perhaps generate more general awareness, more general interest and try to get more people to participate in the process. The cost to place this large bulk ad once in the six papers, as you can see, is $9,600, giving a total media buy per occurrence on a semi-annual basis of $17,300.
MS. LEBLANC: We asked Darlene to do a little query for us to find out how some of these agencies, boards and commissions supplement their current ads, which, as you know, are twice a year. Some commissioners just mention it to other people they know in the community who might fit the profile, a few have district-specific ads, or the health boards in particular, where they're looking for a particular community, a rural community, e-mail groups and listservs. The Advisory Council on the Status of Women, I believe, for example, will post on their agency Web sites and some use on-line newsletters.
Now this is just a very rough idea of some of the other venues and some of the other ways that some of these agencies, boards and commissions are getting the word out that there are vacancies and that Nova Scotians are welcome. This is, I think, eight of the 14 departments that were contacted by the Legislative Committees Office. So that just gives you an idea that it's done in many different ways. I know from the discussion last time that people were interested in knowing about other options that are open to supplement these ads, including news releases, the use of Web sites, database development and how best to gear which things are working. That's, hopefully, what I can provide you, some of the options and some of the answers to those questions, and then you can go from there.
The first option is the Communications Nova Scotia news release. Basically the news release can take a couple of different formats. We could use a feature type of format, where a particular individual or a particular agency, board or commission is used as an example of the type of people and the type of work that's done, or we can just use a straightforward, the vacancies are now available and watch your newspapers for details in the ads.
A Communications Nova Scotia news release reaches approximately 160 media across the province and some national. The good news about the Communications Nova Scotia database is that we reach all kinds of media. It's not just the daily newspapers, we do reach the rural community weeklies, and we also reach a number of specialty publications, which may be of interest for some of these agencies, boards and commissions. The Micmac-Maliseet Nations News, Touch Base, which I'm sure many of you are familiar with, Farm Focus; there are a lot of specialty publications that you can reach through these news releases.
The other advantage is we've become part of the electronic archive. All news releases from Communications Nova Scotia are on the government main Web page, and they are searchable, then, by keyword. So anyone who's looking for future information will be able to look at those past news releases. It's a good way to increase the overall awareness and answer non-specific questions, that won't give people an answer as to how many positions on one particular agency are available at this time, but it will give people an overall view of what agencies, boards and commissions do and how they operate.
The other avenue that is a possibility is Web site. I'm just going to start out with a few basic statistics on Web site use. I know there were some questions about how useful Web site material could be. Statistics Canada says that in 2003, 63 per cent of households in Nova Scotia had at least one regular Internet user, and 53 per cent of Nova Scotia households with one regular user had access to the Internet from their home, which means they're not at the office, they're not in their workplace or at school, they're actually accessing from home.
An interesting figure out of Statistics Canada's most recent figures is 32 per cent of Canadian households that use the Internet from home actually use it to seek government
information, which is fairly high. That number, I think, is fairly significant, when you look at 52 per cent use it for e-mail and only 21 per cent use it for downloading music, but that's often what you will hear about through the mainstream media, downloading of music. So 32 per cent of those Canadian households that use the Internet from home are using it to go to government sites, to look for some kind of information. That's a little background that may help you think about what we're going to talk about now, which is the possibility of Web page supplements for your advertising.
[1:15 p.m.]
As I'm sure you're aware right now, there is a little bit of information on agencies, boards and commissions through the Executive Council site but what we're recommending is that we start a secondary page, a new Web page that gives a full list of agencies, boards and commissions so that everybody has somewhere that they can go. This could be broken down in a number of ways: by government department or by the number of positions that are available, any number of ways that you could break that down into more usable chunks, but somewhere, a full list of agencies, boards and commissions so people understand how many there are and the breadth.
It will provide a central repository for information. What I am talking about here is, again, very general information, general explanations so that people understand what we're talking about when we're talking about agencies, boards and commissions and the types of positions, the number of boards that we're dealing with, and then you can supplement that with the information on the specific vacancies, how to apply, where do I get the application. Electronic copies of the ads can also be on that site. You can have links to the news releases as well.
Links with the Executive Council page, that's important. There is already some information there for people who are interested in the adjudicative sites. This would just supplement that link from the government home page, obviously, and again, as I say, the news releases. I understand we currently have links from the Employment Opportunities and Career Beacon pages too, what we call PDFs, the electronic versions of the ads. You can also continue to have that kind of interface.
Over the long-term, the possibilities for Web site development are broad. I mean, we can make it as sophisticated or as simple as government chooses. You can develop a page so more information could be, what we call, pop-up pages. Each agency could have a little pop-up window that comes up when you click on their title that says how many positions are currently available, where they can get more information.
You could have links to the individual agencies, boards and commissions for those that do have existing sites. With the ad, as David mentioned, we have broken it down into departmental responsibilities, you could have links with that. The opportunities are certainly
there, it is just a question of how sophisticated, how much time and resources we want to address this.
Now, the one thing that I will also mention is the need for development, but the need for sustainability. It doesn't do any good to have a Web site if the information is not continually maintained. Someone getting wrong information is as bad as getting no information. You want to make sure that the vacancies are kept current; that is, the accuracy and maintenance of it would be something that you would want to address before going live with a Web site.
The other thing that was, I guess, discussed at the committee level was database development. Certainly, I think it's something worth exploring with the agencies, boards and commissions. Each agency and board probably has their own list of stakeholders, the people that they're interested in reaching. The question becomes, again, maintaining that list, maintaining the e-mail addresses or telephone numbers, making sure that there is somewhere for them to contact, further information once you've got the message out to them. We can send electronic copies of the ads. There are capabilities already in place, it's just a question of how many of these options and what you would like to proceed from there.
The final option that I wanted to bring to your attention, there was a question about telephone access. Service Nova Scotia and Municipal Relations, as I'm sure you know, has the Public Inquiries Call Centre. It is an option that government might want to consider, also, as far as agencies, boards and commissions vacancies. The call centre is able to take calls on any subject but they do need to have a script. They need to have the information provided to them. In this case, it would be one of two sets of information: either information strictly on the application process, or information on where specific vacancies currently exist. Again, it's a question of how complicated, how detailed you want your response to be. At the very least, they need to have a series of names, telephones, places that the public can get more information if they choose to proceed from there.
This kind of information isn't currently available, to my knowledge, at the Public Inquiries Call Centre, so it would be a question of gathering the appropriate information and making sure that they were provided with that kind of information. Again, regular maintenance is going to be an ongoing issue with any kind of database that you're talking about with more than 100 agencies, boards and commissions, some of which having several vacancies at various times, you want to make sure that the information is maintained and that it is kept up to date.
The one thing that I would recommend is that no matter which of the options you choose to explore and proceed with, measure the results, check the number of applications, the hits on the Web site, the number of telephone calls if, indeed, you were to proceed with the public inquiries line, and see which measures are working best and develop those further; apply the lessons learned to improve your response rate.
I think a couple of those options are more long-term than short-term, especially where you are looking at bulk ads for the Fall, because of the massive amount of information that you will be trying to gather. Some will be easier to put together. News releases are fairly straightforward. That information is going to be fairly straightforward to gather.
Web page development can be ongoing short- and long-term additions to that Web page. The database development and the use of the Service Nova Scotia Public Inquiries line might be a little more labour-intensive. Obviously, each of these options will come with associated costs that you will want to explore but these are some of the options, in general, that may be of interest to you. That's my presentation. Thank you.
MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much. Are there any questions for our presenters?
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: I would just make a comment. It was a really good presentation. I love the cleanness of this ad. It's just laid out so well. You can see in a moment what the departments are. I realize that the little groups underneath don't really correspond with this, but it would make such a difference to have it laid out like that.
MR. BELL: Certainly, our intention was to be user-friendly and as I mentioned to you, some sense of explanation for what the process entails, that seems to be missing a little bit.
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: Yes, you don't have a sense here, you need a magnifying glass or you're going blind - that other one is so busy.
MR. BELL: I will point out, this is somewhat reduced just to fit on the pages. It's about 15 per cent smaller than what will actually appear, if you choose to go with that.
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: It's very good.
MS. DIANA WHALEN: Just for clarification, it would look 15 per cent larger in the paper?
MR. BELL: Yes, it would be run the full depth on The ChronicleHerald page.
MS. WHALEN: Oh, okay. That's good.
MR. CHAIRMAN: Okay, any further questions? If not, on behalf of the committee, we thank you very much for giving us this presentation today. We will be working on this presentation to try to come up with a solution to our problems. If we have any further questions, we will no doubt be talking to you. Thank you.
Okay, well, there's quite a bit of information here today to go over and try to deal with. As everybody knows, our bulk ad will be going out probably in October, so we have to make some decisions sometime soon as to how we are going to proceed.
Darlene tells me that she will be away for the August 31st meeting, our next one, so we're going to have to work around her timeline as well. She's on vacation. Somebody who will be replacing her for the August 31st meeting probably doesn't have the knowledge that Darlene has as a resource person to help us along. What are the suggestions, what are the thoughts of the committee?
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: If we meet in early September, when Darlene comes back, would that give us enough time to plan so that we have the October situation well in hand, in advance?
MR. CHAIRMAN: Either that or we could meet in early August before Darlene leaves, within the next couple of weeks. Probably the September - will that give us enough time to . . .
MRS. DARLENE HENRY (Legislative Committee Clerk): It may give us enough time. You'd have to be very concise as to what you want so that we can get moving right away. We may be able to do it. The departments will be contacted in early September to be sending their information to the office here so that we can get all the nuts and bolts of it. Our job would be, basically, where we are going to put it now and how fast you want it out. As far as I know, I have to have that out by mid-October.
MR. CHAIRMAN: Ms. Whalen.
MS. WHALEN: I was thinking, maybe it would be better if we meet in early August before you go away, just so that we can come to some decision and it wouldn't be such a rush. If we leave it until September, it sounds like you may be a little unsure about whether it will allow you enough time to do it properly.
MRS. HENRY: Only because sometimes you get people who change their minds saying, well, can we add this one or take this one away, something that may crop up that would be unforeseeable, I don't know.
MS. WHALEN: That's right. I'm certainly agreeable, I'm just suggesting that if the committee would like to do that in a couple weeks' time - I'm not sure when you leave, but before you go - in that way at least the direction would be set, and you would know what to do upon return, if the committee is agreeable. I think maybe that would be best, because we've said it's a priority for us.
MR. CHAIRMAN: I believe our timeline is probably October 1st, as far as getting the ad ready to go. So that's just allowing us the month. If we did meet early in August, before Darlene goes away, it probably would be better.
MS. WHALEN: If I could, Mr. Chairman, it seems like a lot of the items that have been mentioned - they all look good. I think we just need to decide if we want to choose several that we do in this one in October. When I was seeing it unfold it looked like they would all be a good thing to do. I think the more extensively and broadly we advertise, the more different media and means that we take, the better. As a committee, we just need to decide if we want to do a few that we can measure in this October ad, and perhaps the ones that are not as costly - certainly the Web links - I think there were a couple of them that sounded good.
Developing the stakeholder list for each ABC, I would be prepared to say that the ABCs should move on that, and that we should ask them to, because that will take them some time. That won't happen by October, that they're ready to do that, I wouldn't imagine, or not extensively, not completely - maybe they could do some. I would like to see them get going on as many different avenues of contact as possible. I know we haven't had time to read all the information they've given us.
MR. CHAIRMAN: A couple weeks will give us time to do that. Ms. MacDonald, do you have something?
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: I was just thinking about the sustainability piece, the resources to maintain a Web site and to provide timely information to a call centre. Those were two of the options that were looked at. Darlene, maybe you could help us with that, by inquiring with the appropriate department what that would take from the resources that we have to work with, as a committee, around that. I have this feeling that we're going to have to look at what we have and, then from what we have, what it is that we can do that makes the most sense. Is that fair enough?
MRS. HENRY: Sure, okay.
MR. CHAIRMAN: Mr. Glavine.
MR. LEO GLAVINE: This is such a step in the right direction of improvement over what has been in the newspaper. My recommendation, right off, would be that, as a starting point, we definitely go with this and then give some thought in August to what other pieces we would venture forth with that would also broaden the avenues of getting the advertising out. Certainly my view right off is that this presents itself so much stronger than what we have seen in the past. I'm wondering if today, as a committee, we could move that we have one of the central pieces, the dailies, using this format here, and then look at some of the other areas.
[1:30 p.m.]
The other thing that I was going to mention was, again, using the available bulletin boards, when we think of the number of government offices and so forth around the province. I think they should be one of the vehicles, as well, that we use in the future in a very consistent way. If you do up 200 posters, or whatever, I think, again, it's another very strong visual, very often, when you come into an office, that may have a good appeal.
MR. CHAIRMAN: That's probably something each department can do on their own. I don't know if we have to send them out to each department, departments should be able to . . .
MRS. HENRY: We send them out to the departments, but whether they put them up or not . . .
MR. GLAVINE: They do go out now, do they?
MRS. HENRY: Oh, they always have.
MR. GLAVINE: Again, I think the formatting of the poster, as well, is a big factor.
MR. CHAIRMAN: If that was a direction of the committee, maybe we could send a letter to each department and ask them if they could see to it that this is being done. That would probably be the easiest way of handling that one. Ms. Massey.
MS. JOAN MASSEY: When you're talking about posters and that sort of visual impact, is it maybe a possibility - I didn't hear it here this morning - that we could have those things posted in community centres, I'm thinking high schools, because I think, in this information that we really haven't had that much time to read through, the responses from the different departments are very interesting. I think one of the departments does mention it's hard to get youth involved on these ABCs. Also, another department was talking about how it's very hard to get people from the rural areas on the ABCs. I think maybe those are two areas that we need to focus on. We have been talking about some other groups and organizations, but I think maybe we haven't focused on those two areas enough yet. So, just to keep that in mind when we're looking at following through.
But I agree, this is fantastic. "Nova Scotia Needs You", I love it. I still don't see a telephone number on there, but I don't know if that's an impossibility. I still would like to see a telephone number. If we get the call centre thing going, I think that's a fabulous idea, but, then again, do we have the resources and what is that going to entail? It's certainly a good place to step off from.
MR. CHAIRMAN: So is everybody in agreement that we meet in early August? Is there any chance of setting a date today? August 10th?
MR. GLAVINE: I'm just wondering what her timeline is.
MRS. HENRY: My last day is August 13th. (Interruptions)
MR. CHAIRMAN: August 10th is on a Tuesday.
MRS. HENRY: In keeping with your schedule, but a week in between.
MS. MASSEY: Mr. Chairman, same time, same place?
MR. CHAIRMAN: Would 1:00 p.m. be all right? Okay, we have our next ABCs meeting date for August 31st, but the other issue, too, we had another letter from Debbie Madore, the Nutrition for Learning Coordinator at the Cape Breton-Victoria Regional School Board. If you recall, that went to Community Services and then it came back to us, we sent it back to Community Services, and that sort of thing. I guess our committee felt it was an issue that should be dealt by Community Services. We have a letter drafted here to go to her, saying that we've sent it back to the Community Services Committee again. I guess it doesn't deal directly with education as such, as we had decided the last time. We have another letter drafted to go to her again, if that's all right with the committee.
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: We have already referred it to the Community Services Committee, right?
MR. CHAIRMAN: They referred it to us.
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: They referred it back to us?
MR. CHAIRMAN: Yes, back to us again. But apparently she sent a letter to our committee, as well as the Community Services Committee to meet with each one of us. The Community Services Committee should probably be dealing with it again.
MRS. HENRY: I believe they will be when they start in September, when they start picking up their schedule again.
MR. CHAIRMAN: But if anybody wants to read it . . .
MS. MAUREEN MACDONALD: No, that's fine.
MR. CHAIRMAN: . . . we'll send you a copy of all the correspondence that has gone back and forth so far, just for your information.
MRS. HENRY: Your August 31st meeting, I'm just wondering what time you want to meet on that, for sure, because the Petroleum Product Pricing Committee is tabling a report, but I'm not sure if they're going to be doing that in the morning, or not. They're mandated to table their report in the House on that day, so I don't know if that's - there are some conflicts on this committee with regard to the other committees.
MR. CHAIRMAN: Yes.
MRS. HENRY: I do have 9:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. down but it depends on yourselves, if you want to change that to the afternoon, or not.
MR. CHAIRMAN: How about setting it for 9:00 a.m. and if we see a conflict, that we will maybe notify the committee of a change, maybe to 1:00 p.m., if they're going to present their report in the morning. Would that be all right? If we see a conflict, we'll advise.
Okay, motion to adjourn.
MR. O'DONNELL: I so move.
MR. CHAIRMAN: The meeting is adjourned.
[The committee adjourned at 1:37 p.m.]